I had a very similar upbringing but I fundamentally disagree that Christ’s message isn’t political. Christ was a political figure in his era, executed for political reasons. Early Church history is full of Christians being tortured and executed by sovereigns.
I think you’re correct only to the extent that Christianity won’t tell you how to set budget priorities for FY2024, but Christ’s message will almost certainly inform certain decisions made in that budget, like feeding the hungry, housing the homeless, welcoming migrants, and pursuing justice and mercy. And to the extent that we have one political party who consistently claims to represent Christ’s teachings and similarly rejects Christ’s message as applied to the policies they support, it’s inherently political right now as well.
That is cherrypicking a single verse if I’ve ever seen it. (For reference: “Matthew 15:24 But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.””) You gotta look at some context elsewhere as well - Jesus couldn’t be everywhere at once and had to start somewhere, and Israel was really supposed to be a shining example to all people, the priests for all nations showing love to everybody.
Sure the context. A women comes to beg for her son. Jesus tells her he can’t help. She grovels at her feet and calls herself a racial slur. And only then does he agree to spend a minute helping.
I agree I should definitely mention the groveling and bigotry of the story. Thanks for the correction. I would hate for people to think that fictional character wasn’t a bigot.
To expand a bit, Christ said, "“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”
It’s not so much about Jesus himself being a political figure, it’s more a question of which ideologies more closely align with his teachings. So it’s probably more accurate to say “liberal ideology is significantly more similar to Jesus’s teachings than conservative ideology.”
Yeah I hear you. I was raised Episcopalian/Anglican and I was always shocked at the horror stories I heard from other kids coming from more conservative denominations. I was like “I don’t believe any of the supernatural stuff but youth group is fun and it’s not like they’re preaching bad things…”
That said, the historical Jesus was an apocalyptic preacher. Essentially no modern denominations get it right. Essentially all Christianities today are extremely Westernized as opposed to Semitic.
I’m about as atheist as it gets, not like the angry kind but I firmly don’t believe any kind of higher power exists, at least in the way religions do. I grew up in a Christian family and went to church in my early years. I guess the message got through to me because that’s basically my philosophy just without all the spiritual stuff.
I have to ask this. How is feed the hungry not political. I jist don’t get how there can be apolitical morality, or laws. What isca politic what makes something’s political
You’re right. His teachings (on how the individual should act) are politics, and they are viable as the basis for a political system. It was actually put into practice, too, in monasteries and other communes.
I think the problem stems from cognitive dissonance. The popular political ideology that most closely reflect his neighborly teachings, is anarcho-communism. That is the exact opposite ideology from fascism (i.e., in-group authoritarianism) which is the ideology practiced by most of his adherents.
They are motivated to find ways to convince themselves and others that the teachings aren’t political, so that they don’t have to reconcile the teachings of their in-group identifier/shibboleth with their practices in the real world.
(I’m not saying this is why everyone says it isn’t political, I’m saying that this is the source of the meme that religion-isn’t-political.)
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I had a very similar upbringing but I fundamentally disagree that Christ’s message isn’t political. Christ was a political figure in his era, executed for political reasons. Early Church history is full of Christians being tortured and executed by sovereigns.
I think you’re correct only to the extent that Christianity won’t tell you how to set budget priorities for FY2024, but Christ’s message will almost certainly inform certain decisions made in that budget, like feeding the hungry, housing the homeless, welcoming migrants, and pursuing justice and mercy. And to the extent that we have one political party who consistently claims to represent Christ’s teachings and similarly rejects Christ’s message as applied to the policies they support, it’s inherently political right now as well.
Idk man, “help those in need” is basically a liberal only position these days.
Matthew 15:24
That is cherrypicking a single verse if I’ve ever seen it. (For reference: “Matthew 15:24 But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.””) You gotta look at some context elsewhere as well - Jesus couldn’t be everywhere at once and had to start somewhere, and Israel was really supposed to be a shining example to all people, the priests for all nations showing love to everybody.
Sure the context. A women comes to beg for her son. Jesus tells her he can’t help. She grovels at her feet and calls herself a racial slur. And only then does he agree to spend a minute helping.
I agree I should definitely mention the groveling and bigotry of the story. Thanks for the correction. I would hate for people to think that fictional character wasn’t a bigot.
To expand a bit, Christ said, "“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”
My favourite passage. Matthew 22: 36-40
It’s not so much about Jesus himself being a political figure, it’s more a question of which ideologies more closely align with his teachings. So it’s probably more accurate to say “liberal ideology is significantly more similar to Jesus’s teachings than conservative ideology.”
Yeah I hear you. I was raised Episcopalian/Anglican and I was always shocked at the horror stories I heard from other kids coming from more conservative denominations. I was like “I don’t believe any of the supernatural stuff but youth group is fun and it’s not like they’re preaching bad things…”
That said, the historical Jesus was an apocalyptic preacher. Essentially no modern denominations get it right. Essentially all Christianities today are extremely Westernized as opposed to Semitic.
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I’m about as atheist as it gets, not like the angry kind but I firmly don’t believe any kind of higher power exists, at least in the way religions do. I grew up in a Christian family and went to church in my early years. I guess the message got through to me because that’s basically my philosophy just without all the spiritual stuff.
I have to ask this. How is feed the hungry not political. I jist don’t get how there can be apolitical morality, or laws. What isca politic what makes something’s political
You’re right. His teachings (on how the individual should act) are politics, and they are viable as the basis for a political system. It was actually put into practice, too, in monasteries and other communes.
I think the problem stems from cognitive dissonance. The popular political ideology that most closely reflect his neighborly teachings, is anarcho-communism. That is the exact opposite ideology from fascism (i.e., in-group authoritarianism) which is the ideology practiced by most of his adherents.
They are motivated to find ways to convince themselves and others that the teachings aren’t political, so that they don’t have to reconcile the teachings of their in-group identifier/shibboleth with their practices in the real world.
(I’m not saying this is why everyone says it isn’t political, I’m saying that this is the source of the meme that religion-isn’t-political.)
I guess they didn’t read the Gospel of Matthew in that case.